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 Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight

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Owlg8tr
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Rog
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PostSubject: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeSat Apr 18, 2009 10:24 am

Who is Americans for Prosperity? According to SourceWatch.org, the group was founded in 2003 with money from the Charles G. Koch Charitable Foundation, which is run by the billionaires behind Kansas-based Koch Industries -- the national's largest privately held oil and gas company. Media Transparency reports that the group gets substantial financial support from the Claude R. Lambe Charitable Foundation, another one of the Koch family foundations.

Why would an organization funded by oil and gas interests be hostile to the economic stimulus plan?

Could it be the $50 billion the bill offers for more sustainable energy alternatives?

http://www.southernstudies.org/2009/02/the-oil-money-behind-the-anti-stimulus-fight.html
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeSat Apr 18, 2009 10:37 am

Of course. Sustainable energy provides little to no long term income for oil companies, shit if it did we would have liberated our lips from the middle eastern tit many moons ago.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeSat Apr 18, 2009 10:56 am

Describe "sustainable" energy.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeSat Apr 18, 2009 12:12 pm

Justoo would already be aware of the Koch connection if he'd bothered to read the article I posted.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeSat Apr 18, 2009 1:23 pm

I am aware of the Koch family and their energy holdings as well as their infighting.

But that doesn't tell me what sustainable is.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeSat Apr 18, 2009 3:06 pm

Big oil makes Big money, Big deal.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeSat Apr 18, 2009 5:51 pm

Justtoo,
Sustainable means simply that the energy balance is positive, not negative like all fossil fuels. That is the production cycle from the field to the tank produces more energy that was required to grow, process and deliver the final form of energy. Biodiesel has the highest according to University of Idaho. Biodiesel energy balance is +4.56.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeSat Apr 18, 2009 6:18 pm

If biodiesel is so sustainable, why are they closing so many plants and not opening others?
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeSat Apr 18, 2009 6:52 pm

Sustainable and economically competitive are two different things.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeSat Apr 18, 2009 7:22 pm

It is economics. Just like the oil patch has the snowbird wells they crank up when the price is high and down when the price is low. 2008 set a record production of biodiesel because the newer, larger, more efficient plants are still producing and the smaller older inefficient go by the way side. That is business. There is economy of scale plus the smaller plants usually cannot produce fuel to the quality to make it a legal fuel for highway use. The engine and injector manufacturers demand BQ 9000 quality fuel before they will warrant the equipment. Back yard boot leg that is not road taxed might be 50 cents (equals tax) cheaper but does not meet ASTM. It is a free country to manufactures have the explicit right to set the conditions of their warranties.
Much of the most profitable biodiesel currently is coming from used fry oil and rendering greases. Read the Render Magazine for Jan/Feb. Modern plants are multi feed stock so they can go to the market and use the most profitable. there is a small plant at Sedgswick that is effieicent using used oil and grease and vegetable oil if cheap enough. They make to ASTM 6751, collect their incentive and sell it at a public pump. You cannot sell a product that is not legal or get an incentive.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeSat Apr 18, 2009 7:56 pm

That's very true. The injectors in the 12.5L engines in the John Deere 9000-series tractors don't do well with biodiesel. And unless the fuel meets certain requirements (or unless you buy LOTS of equipment from them), Deere won't warranty them.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeSun Apr 19, 2009 12:44 am

Natural Gas.....thats all I'll say.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeSun Apr 19, 2009 8:30 am

Here are all of the OEM (Original Equipiment Manufacturer) fuel statements regarding biodiesel.
http://www.biodiesel.org/pdf_files/OEM%20Statements/OEM_Statements_Summary.pdf

All diesel engines have two warrantys. One for the engine and one for the injection system. Both must be satisfied by the fuel. All fuel at a public pump must be a legal fuel. Illegal fuel used on the highway is still subject to Federal and State road tax. Only fair.

Used fry oil, vegetable oil, or fuels that don't meet ASTM 6751 are not legal fuels. You can run up to 75,000 gallons of home brew biodiesel in your own off road equipment. You cannot sell home brew that does not meet ASTM 6751 and if it does meet ASTM 6751, road taxes must be collected. A shady area is a biodiesel coop. Road tax is still in effect if the fuel goes on the road.

The new 2 liter VW TDI or Mercedes CDI Bluetech engine is the same basic engine. They developed it together. The injection systems are different although both made by Bosch. Mercedes uses a urea solution to burn off the downstream treatment equipment (Cat converter and partiulate trap) as needed. VW TDI uses raw fuel injected in the cylinder at the bottom of the scavenge stroke. Here in lies the source of VWs 5% biodiesel restriction. With maximum cylinder wall exposure, there is crankcase dillution of fuel, both ULSD and biodiesel. In a blend, the good trait of thermal stability of biodiesel works to its disadvantage. ULSD will vaporize and boil of at 215 degrees F and biodiesel boils off at 315 degrees F. So biodiesel will accumulate in the 5W40 synthetic lub oil and become over full in the 10,000 oil change cycle. All other engines, including Bluetech , inject down stream and don't have this situation. VW will change its point of injection.

HOpe this helps
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeTue Apr 21, 2009 6:21 am

How Green Is Biodiesel?



Friday , April 17, 2009


By Jason Gurskis



When
it comes to our energy woes, there may be a light at the end of the
tunnel -- a green light, and one not powered by petroleum.

We may be able to curb our addiction to fossil fuels by using
plants, animal fats and old restaurant grease. But there are a few
drawbacks.

Consumers are already familiar with ethanol, a simple alcohol
distilled from corn and often added to gasoline. But even easier to
produce is biodiesel, a mixture of more complex molecules that can be
made from all sorts of fats and oils, including leftover foodstuffs.

• Click here for more photos.

Biodiesel is safe to handle, nontoxic and biodegradable. Its
proponents says it's a cleaner-burning replacement for petroleum-based
fuels and that its use will greatly reduce greenhouse-gas emissions and
other toxic air pollutants.

"Biodiesel could be one of the best carbon-mitigation processes
available today for heavy-duty vehicles like trucks and buses," says
Jenna Higgins, spokeswoman for the National Biodiesel Board, based in
Jefferson City, Mo. "It works with what we have, and we don't have to
wait for new technologies to use it."

The concept of biodiesel is surprisingly old. In the 1890s, Rudolf
Diesel envisioned vegetable oil as a fuel source for his engine. In
1900, the diesel engine was demonstrated at the World Exhibition in
Paris, France, running on peanut oil.

Biodiesel can be used "neat" in a formulation known as B100 (100
percent biodiesel), or blended with petroleum diesel. A 20 percent
blend is called B20. The Department of Energy says B20 reduces a diesel
engine's carbon-dioxide emissions by 15 percent, and B100 by more than
75 percent.

And carbon dioxide released by biodiesel combustion is offset by the
carbon dioxide sequestered while growing the soybeans and other
feedstock.

Yet biodiesel almost sounds too good to be true -- and many experts say it is.

"Biodiesel is, of course, made from vegetable oils that are food
crops, such as palm and soy, which have played a significant role in
deforestation," explains Jimmie Powell of the Arlington, Va.-based
Nature Conservancy. "Dramatically expanding production to meet new
demand for biodiesel would not only continue to worsen the problem, it
would also have severe impacts on food prices in the developing world."

In some places, current crops can't keep pace with the bio-materials
needed for producing biodiesel. Even though biodiesel is undoubtedly
greener than traditional petroleum-based fuel, there's little or no
regulation on how and where it's produced.

Palm oil, for example, is commonly used for cooking and as an
additive in foods. Growing it has been big business in Southeast Asia
since the mid-19th century, and it's only getting bigger.

Between 1995 and 2005, nearly 8.6 million acres of land in
Indonesia, including vast tracts of forests and peat bogs, were
converted to palm-oil plantations, more than doubling total plantation
area, according to a recent report by Credit Suisse.

Tropical forests help remove millions of tons of carbon dioxide from
the atmosphere every year. Burning and clear-cutting these forests to
grow biofuel crops not only eliminates one of the planet's own natural
air-filtration systems, but the process of land clearing itself
releases even more carbon dioxide into the air as smoke or gases
released during the decomposition of forest waste.

"It's unfortunate these practices give biodiesel a bad name," says
Robert McCormick at the DoE's National Renewable Energy Laboratory in
Golden, Colo. "There are plantations that are sustainable."

According to the National Biodiesel Board, a vast majority of the
feedstock used to make biodiesel in the United States is grown
responsibly and sustainably. Most of the domestic stock comes from
soybean oil, mainly because the U.S. is the world's largest producer of
soybeans.

"Sixty-five percent of all biodiesel used in this country comes from
soybeans," explains Victor Bohuslavsky, executive directory of the
Nebraska Soybean Board, based in Lincoln, Neb. "Eighty-six percent of
soybeans produced was used in food. We can find good uses for the
balance, and biodiesel is one of them."

Most experts agree that biodiesel is a good alternative to imported petroleum, despite the complications.

"It's not an easy problem to solve, because we've built our entire
system around coal and petroleum," explains Kert Davies, research
director for Greenpeace. "We have to be creative and look at a diverse
set of solutions to solve our addiction to oil."

The DoE's McCormick agrees.

"Using biodiesel is not going to end petroleum imports," he says, "but it is an important part of the solution."
http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,516738,00.html
Sounds like it is sustainable only if you limit production to a sustainable level.
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nitromaxx98
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeTue Apr 21, 2009 9:25 am

No matter the source of future energy, absolute power will corrupt absolutely. Someone will get richer, another poorer. 100 years from now it will be the same discussion with a different noun in the title.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeTue Apr 21, 2009 9:29 am

Justoo, Here is some more information. The clearing of forests in Brazil have been 85% to increace gazing area for the expanding beef industry. Brazil will surpass US in beef production and exports. The Time magazine by Searchinger over a year ago did not give credit to the co products of biodiesel or ethanol. The food for fuel people were mistaken that ethanol and biodiesel caused the inflation of food prices.
First, ethanol only uses the starch or sugars of the grains or sorghums. These energy components are surplus in our food system as you view the fat people. The protein which is the main food element is intact in the food chain for further use.
Biodiesel uses the oil from processing soybeans to soy meal, 93% of which is used in the food chain in animal agriculture. The vegetable oil is actually a surplus item that was sold at a discount making food soy based foods and meat more expensive to cover the loss. In other words, biodiesel from soy oil added value to the oil which allowed the protein foods to reamain relativly cheaper than if the oil had to be disposed of at a discount. The glycerin co product of biodiesel contains more energy, pound for pound, than propane. So technology is developing from a Kansas City researcher and KU Petroleum and Chemical Engineering Depts. to use a reformer to harvest the rich hydrogen from glycering in the field to run pump engines in the field. Glycerin is also used to add energy to animal rations that use distillers dry grain (rich in protein) for feed. This replaces the starch used to make ethanol.
The below article came out today on Doane's reports may be of interest as to new technologies. If Holcomb gets built, Sunflower will be the largest biodiesel producer in Kansas.

OriginOil announces breakthrough process to extract oil from algae
Apr. 21, 2009

LOS ANGELES -- OriginOil Inc. has announced an innovative single-step process to extract oil from algae. In addition to integrating this process into its own production system, OriginOil plans to rapidly commercialize the patent-pending process for use by others in the fast-growing algae industry.

Initial testing indicates that the new algae oil extraction process is simpler and more efficient than current systems, without requiring chemicals or significant capital expenditure for heavy machinery.

"Throughout the world, algae production is becoming a fact, but it still has to be harvested efficiently," said Riggs Eckelberry, CEO of OriginOil. "Our breakthrough technology accomplishes key parts of the harvesting process in a single, cost-effective step. We are planning to make our new technology available to our fast-growing industry."
The company recently filed for patent protection of the new algae oil extraction process, its seventh patent application, entitled "Device and Method for Separation, Cell Lysing and Flocculation of Algae From Water."

OriginOil CTO Dr Vikram Pattarkine said, "With this new process, we have greatly improved on our previous harvesting technology. We now have a single device and process that we will optimize and scale up in upcoming trials for commercialization."

Harvesting algae is a challenge. Algae grow suspended in large volumes of water. Once ready for harvest, the algae culture must be concentrated and the oil extracted from each cell. Then, the oil, water and biomass must all be separated for processing. The new OriginOil process achieves all these steps in one pass.

In the process, the company's Quantum Fracturing(TM) combines with electromagnetism and pH modification to break down cell walls, thereby releasing the oil within these cells. Algae oil rises to the top for skimming and refining, while the remaining biomass settles to the bottom for further processing as fuel and other valuable products.
CEO Riggs Eckelberry will provide process details at the National Algae Association's Forum on April 30, 2009.

Meanwhile, he will discuss the technology and OriginOil's work with the Department of Energy on scaling up biofuels production in Washington, DC this week. "The Obama Administration has targeted renewable energy for 10 million new jobs in the next decade," concluded Eckelberry. "OriginOil plans to license its technology to help transform algae into a renewable and sustainable replacement for petroleum."

OriginOil Inc. is developing a breakthrough technology that will transform algae, the most promising source of renewable oil, into a true competitor to petroleum. Much of the world's oil and gas is made up of ancient algae deposits. Today, our technology will produce "new oil" from algae, through a cost-effective, high-speed manufacturing process. This endless supply of new oil can be used for many products, such as diesel, gasoline, jet fuel, plastics and solvents, without the global warming effects of petroleum.

SOURCE: OriginOil, Inc. via Business Wire.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeTue Apr 21, 2009 10:13 am

Justoo
Quote :

Between 1995 and 2005, nearly 8.6 million acres of land in
Indonesia, including vast tracts of forests and peat bogs, were
converted to palm-oil plantations, more than doubling total plantation
area, according to a recent report by Credit Suisse.

cracker
Quote :

The clearing of forests in Brazil have been 85% to increace gazing area for the expanding beef industry.

While you may be right about the forests in Brazil, it has no bearing on the deforestation and peat bog destruction in Indonesia.

And while it is an interesting article that you posted, algae production has what to do with biodiesel.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeTue Apr 21, 2009 11:10 am

In a few thousand years, WE will be the oil...

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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeTue Apr 21, 2009 11:44 am

Justoo, it was Searchinger that claimed production of biodiesel was causing the rape of Indonesia. Indonesia increased production of palm oil mainly for the Chinese food oil market. You can follow the Indonesian markets at www.btimes.com.my/

As for algae, it is 60% high quality vegitable oil and make high quality biodiesel. It doe not take any resources away from food production.
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeTue Apr 21, 2009 11:58 am

cracker wrote:
As for algae, it is 60% high quality vegitable oil and make high quality biodiesel. It does not take any resources away from food production.

Doesn't add much either lately..

LINK HERE
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeTue Apr 21, 2009 12:06 pm

nitromaxx98 wrote:
In a few thousand years, WE will be the oil...


whatever will be, will be....
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PostSubject: Re: Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight   Investigation: The oil money behind the anti-stimulus fight Icon_minitimeTue Apr 21, 2009 3:36 pm

quesera wrote:
whatever will be, will be....

...the future's not ours to see...
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que sera sera...
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I always thought Doris Day was hot.
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