Businesses, Churches, Maybe Schools too, Etc. in Hays

So...today at work, the maintenance guys are putting up a black box on the outside of the building and putting keys to the building in the black box. They tell me that the fire department will have keys to this black box and they are on every business, church, etc. in town, the keys to open the boxes are all one of the same key. In case something happens after hours, they can get in the building without calling anyone and make sure everything is okay. I'm thinking if there is a fire, they can break a door or window down, it sounds like some kind of scam to me. They inform me that it is a law in town that every business has to have it or they get written up by the fire marshall. They explain that if there isn't a really big issue going on and the fire fighters have to break down a $1,000 door, then that's more expense than it is worth. Which does make sense, but I was wondering what do you all think? It's the first I have heard about it.

if one of those keys fall into the wrong hands they will have hell to pay

Yeah, I remember a fireman years ago that was torching places around the county. Not to bash fire fighters by any means, it just scares me is all, too much control, I think.

I know that the rapid entry box and key system is required in some fire districts here on certain buildings due to the buildings use and contents.

OK so whats to keep the bad guys from breaking into the boxes and then getting into the buildings? Dumb idea if you ask me.

Can we paint the boxes to match our poly-carts?

if they need into my place for a fire concern, they can call me. there is no way in hell I would give them my keys. Period!!!!

Exactly! I have a home business and if they ask me to do this, I would tell them where to go, and tell them to write me up. It's f*^&ed up if you ask me...

Is Hays Fire Equipment required to have one? What about the Aquatic Park?

I would probably be better off if they would just let mine burn.

Don't know, I just know that as soon as they installed it, they were supposed to call the FD to get them to come over and install their lock. The aquatic park, hell, they could jump over the dang fence too!

Does your business have one of these Nitro?

slickjay12 wrote:

if one of those keys fall into the wrong hands they will have hell to pay

SlumberGirl wrote:

Yeah, I remember a fireman years ago that was torching places around the county. Not to bash fire fighters by any means, it just scares me is all, too much control, I think.

Not everyone will have them. In Hays I expect maybe the Police Dept. and Fire Dept. command officers will be the only ones who will have them. It may be only chief officers will have access to them, or possibly the duty captain. There's no way they'd give keys to everyone.

One common problem nowdays with electronic alarms is lots of false alarms. And a great many other alarms are only due to minor causes like a hot motor or burned drive belt. A drop in water pressure can cause alarms to trigger if the sprinkler system is tied into the alarms. If they break a window or door every time there's a false alarm or trivial incident alot of damages may be done for nothing.

And some businesses have no easy access windows and have doors that are very difficult to just break through. If the alarm is a real one and they have to spend ten minutes either waiting on a key holder, or gaining entry by force, a fire could spread a long way. In a few minutes a small fire can become an inferno that would destroy the whole place.

next thing you know, the police will decide they should be able to use the keys too for "security purposes" and they'll be snooping into peoples stuff

Yeah, sounds a little like big brother to me...

Nope, not planning on getting one either.

This is the code in some areas here. I have a home business and it does not have any effect on me.

The owner, tenant and/or occupant of said building and/or structure which is 12,000 square feet or more in size and which has an automatic fire suppression system or fire alarm system, exempting owner-occupied single- and two-family dwellings are required to have installed on the same a rapid entry box and key system to allow access to the same and access to boiler rooms, sprinkler control valves, electrical rooms, elevators and elevator control rooms and other locked areas of the premises as may be required by the Bureau of Fire Prevention or Fire Official of the fire district in which said building or structure is located.

I wouldn't worry though. After the government finishes tanking the economy, there won't be any businesses left to install them on.

Unless there's an emergency there is not supposed to be anyone using the keys. And I would not favor random police checks and I doubt it'd pass in the courts either. I would favor a property owner being able to opt out, but in doing so they would be risking liability for any damages or loss of life that may occur to them, or adjoining businesses by waiting for them to arrive.

No shit nitro! I wasn't so much worried about my home business...it's just that we have been broken into so much at work...I feel like we have not compromised our security systems inside though, so we should be okay, except for people that are experts at breaking in locks... I just don't like the thought of keys outside of businesses installed in these black boxes. I just feel like there is too much out of our control.

Is it a conspiracy theory...like painting our streets with just random paint? lol sorry, I had to inject a little humor into this...

there is an old saying that still holds true. "Give them an inch and they'll take a mile"

it always seems like little by little, bit by bit, we lose our rights under the guise of "protection and safety"

Ok, let's examine this. SG in your original post you don't like this box, but it would be ok if the fire crew breaks in? Please explain the logic here.

They already have that mile and getting more everyday. Call me paranoid but I hate Google Earth and am trying to think of places to hide my collection of guns and ammo. Now they tell me they can track my cell phone. Going to move to the desert in a camper with no phone or internet. Come to the city for food, dog food, and beer.

oh sure mr 5-blue-polycarts, try to reason with us.... you know thats a lost cause with a bunch of goofs like us........

Sorry, this is addressed to Ratzy...

Okay, in my original thoughts of today when I heard of this...there is a fire in the building, okay, break down the door and get the fire taken care of. As I have talked to others, I'm thinking, yeah, there could be a small reason that someone needs to be called in to check things out (I have been called to work many times for things like this...after hours) no big deal. It just scares me a little to have our businesses compromised more. Understand that logic?

lowrider wrote:

They already have that mile and getting more everyday. Call me paranoid but I hate Google Earth and am trying to think of places to hide my collection of guns and ammo. Now they tell me they can track my cell phone. Going to move to the desert in a camper with no phone or internet. Come to the city for food, dog food, and beer.

and now more people know about your guns and ammo.......... hey , that would make a good title for a magazine.... guns and ammo... hmmm...

Do you infer that anyone on this site is a snitch. Surely you jest. I thought it was secure.

You know, I'm as anti-big brother as anyone, but Police and Fire Dept already have the legal right to break in as they deem necessary. These boxes do not give them legal right to search at will and have been used around the nation for many years now.

Like I say, I'd favor an opt out for business owners, but in the courts they are going to look really bad if their refusal causes another business to be lost because fire spread before a key holder got there. As far as schools and churches go, What have they got to hide?

Okay, this was for lowrider: ppppsssssttt, big brother is watching...don't tell anyone...

j/k of course...ssssshhhhh

Ratzilla, I'm just concerned with people that could break into the boxes or people that have bad intentions that can legally get into them. Know what I mean?

Ratzilla wrote:

You know, I'm as anti-big brother as anyone, but Police and Fire Dept already have the legal right to break in as they deem necessary. These boxes do not give them legal right to search at will and have been used around the nation for many years now.

Like I say, I'd favor an opt out for business owners, but in the courts they are going to look really bad if their refusal causes another business to be lost because fire spread before a key holder got there. As far as schools and churches go, What have they got to hide?

what do churches have to hide??? surely you jest.............. the catholic church hasn't paid out millions to people for nothing ya know

What guns I don't own any guns. They are evil and go off with no one pulling the trigger injuring people

Yeah and there are crude thefts going on all around us lately and not to mention those conspiracy theories too!!!

Okay, so I'm off the soapbox for tonight. Just wanting other people's opinions on this subject...Thanks to everyone for chirping in...



Cookies and beer for everyone!

SlumberGirl wrote:

Ratzilla, I'm just concerned with people that could break into the boxes or people that have bad intentions that can legally get into them. Know what I mean?

Can they break into that box easier than your door? For ages I've heard comments about how the fucktards from the fire dept. broke in a door for no good reason. This is an honest attempt to help them gain quick non destructive access.

How would you feel if say the Fire Chief had a key to each business door locked in his office instead of a universal key? Like I say, breaking into that box isn't likely any easier than breaking into your door lock unless your business has a bank vault door on it.

Oh, and Luke, your business is a little different. It's not joined by timbers or I-beams to the business next door that can spread fire to your neighbor while you bring the key.

Okay, I've stepped back on to the soapbox, I have no idea if that box is easy to break into, I held it and it was pretty heavy...no idea what would be easier to break into. Just thinking, well, hell, here's a little black box with the keys to building...hhhhmmmmm

Goodnight everyone, didn't mean to p*ss anyone off, just wanted some thoughts on this... and I appreciate everyone's thoughts/ideas too!

Ratzilla wrote:

SlumberGirl wrote:

Ratzilla, I'm just concerned with people that could break into the boxes or people that have bad intentions that can legally get into them. Know what I mean?

Oh, and Luke, your business is a little different. It's not joined by timbers or I-beams to the business next door that can spread fire to your neighbor while you bring the key.

down where I'm at , it wouldn't surprise me if some of the neighbors would want theirs to burn

I'm off my soapbox. I've already said at least a couple times that I favored the idea that a business owner could opt out. But you're probably right. All firemen are crooks and arsonists and we shouldn't trust them. They probably aren't doing this because business owners across the nation were looking for non destructive ways for them to gain access. It's probably all just a trick so police can see if you keep photos of transvestites in your desk.

No, I'm not pissed. Just being an ass.

Yeah Luke, a couple of your neighbors might.

LukeTHr wrote:

oh sure mr 5-blue-polycarts, try to reason with us.... you know thats a lost cause with a bunch of goofs like us........

By the way, what was this for?

Just being an ass.

No matter. I'm enjoying a very fine bottle of ale and that is all that matters now. Damn this shit is good.

that is me being an ass.... thought I better clarify that

The way I see it if the Highway Patrol headquarters had one of those black boxes with their door key inside the fire department workers would not of had to break in their building looking for a safe place to stay a few years back during bad weather.

plowboy wrote:

The way I see it if the Highway Patrol headquarters had one of those black boxes with their door key inside the fire department workers would not of had to break in their building looking for a safe place to stay a few years back during bad weather.

I hope your not serious.

There is an old saying, and I can't remember it exactly, but it goes something like this:

Locks only keep honest people out.

A criminal is going to break into a building if they want to, regardless if there is a key in this box or not. I would suspect that breaking into these boxes wouldn't be that much different then breaking in a door or breaking a window. I assume they can't carry the box away until they break it off the building, so the criminal has two choices, try and break the box off the building or try and break the lock as it hangs on the building, either way they are taking a big chance. Further, the business could probably put the box in certain areas, well lit or near the front door, etc., to further make it difficult to break in.

Also, in our day and age where everyone sues someone, don't you think they would protect the keys to these boxes, if the key master lets the key fall into the wrong hands, don't you think they would have some kind of liability, I do?

The chickenshit firefighters had other places to seek safety from the storm. There are several places in the area to go.