Want Kindergarten? That'll be $500.

CelticDragon wrote:

That was really, really sexist.

No, just really really not PC. Maybe modern 5 year old boys would rather play house and girls want to be football players, but when I was 5 boys were boys and girls were girls. Yes, there were exceptions, but most 5 year old boys were wanting to learn how to play baseball, wrestle around, and get dirty while most girls despised dirt and played with dolls. The boys in my kindergarten class wanted to be outside while the girls prefered to play in the mini kitchen or the dollhouse inside.

Even later in gradeschool, boys might do well in class, but typically it was the girls who liked going to school. All most boys thought of was the recess football games or catching bugs while the girls jumped rope and did their own thing. The playground equipment was the only activity boys and girls did equally.

That is not saying anything about learning abilities, nor is it sexist. It's just the way it was before someone decided that there was no difference between the sexes. It's like saying there are no losers in a game. Sooner or later the kids will learn how lame it all is. When I was 5 more girls liked going to school than boys because of the differences in how they saw the world and that's not a sexist comment. At least it wasn't when men were still allowed an opinion.

Don't the Chinese send their kiddos to school for like 16 hours a day as soon as the are born???And they are super smart!!!The more school the better I say

Probably because the parents work in sweatshops 16 hours a day.

Here's an interesting link about nations education levels. You can look at different aspects of education and how nations rate. In reading, science, and mathematical literacy China doesn't even make the lists.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/edu_rea_lit-education-reading-literacy

wow Maybe I should read more

China actually weeds out the dumber kids though. Most schooling is paid by the government and they don't waste money on the dumb. The government actually allocates the number of spots for college and if you don't make the cut line, you are out. They then allocate the majors. So if want to be a Doctor and there are 200,000 others, but the government thinks they may only need 150,000 (in 8 years when they graduate), so they will only allow 150,000. That is why the kids are in school for 16 hours, they have a bunch riding on it.

That is why it is a communist state.

lilchefed wrote:

China actually weeds out the dumber kids though. Most schooling is paid by the government and they don't waste money on the dumb.

Those are the ones who probably go on to paint toys with lead paint for us.

lilchefed wrote:

That is why it is a communist state.

China, like North Korea and Cuba, is a dictatorship. While there have been socialist governments in the world, there has never been a communist government that met the definitions put forth by Karl Marx, and there will never be one. People and countries just don't work that way.

90% of Chinese people have Cataracks the other 10% drive Rincoln Continentals.

lilchefed wrote:

China actually weeds out the dumber kids though.

Hitler had a method for that also.

The Other One wrote:

lilchefed wrote:

That is why it is a communist state.

China, like North Korea and Cuba, is a dictatorship. While there have been socialist governments in the world, there has never been a communist government that met the definitions put forth by Karl Marx, and there will never be one. People and countries just don't work that way.

Yes, China is a dictatorship ruled by the country's Communist Party, which just happens to be the only party. And while it might not fit Marx strict definition, it is similar and share characteristics to it. What really makes it not a communist state, is that another party could theoretically take over, which isn't likely. Also that its constitution doesn't call itself communist. To me its the toMAto / TOmato debate.

lilchefed wrote:

The Other One wrote:

lilchefed wrote:

That is why it is a communist state.

China, like North Korea and Cuba, is a dictatorship. While there have been socialist governments in the world, there has never been a communist government that met the definitions put forth by Karl Marx, and there will never be one. People and countries just don't work that way.

Yes, China is a dictatorship ruled by the country's Communist Party, which just happens to be the only party. And while it might not fit Marx strict definition, it is similar and share characteristics to it. What really makes it not a communist state, is that another party could theoretically take over, which isn't likely. Also that its constitution doesn't call itself communist. To me its the toMAto / TOmato debate.

No, it's not. A dictatorship gives control to one person. A communist society would mean that nobody would have more power than anyone else. It has never happened and won't ever happen.

The hippy communes and certain other small groups come closer to true communism in that all get a say even though a few still rule to a degree. The old Soviet and Chinese forms of communism are not much different than a capitolist democracy. A few at the top and their buddies make all the rules and take the best for themselves while the majority bust ass to give it to them.

What's that? You say the difference is that America is free and The Soviets and Chinese systems weren't?

Not exactly. In the democracy as we know it you just have a right to bitch as they take your money and put you in prison for disobeying the state. Neither our form of democracy nor communism as we see it practiced give everyone equality. The closest either could come to being fair to all would be on a city or county wide scale where everyone in that community votes on every single issue and you pick the place you want to live in by how close it matches your ideas.

Definitely coming up with a questions list for the board.

Will there be a half day classroom at each school?
Will the half day kids be in with the full day kids and just miss whatever is planned for afternoon?
Will there be only one school with half day K?
If half day K is only in one school, will there be transport provided for those that live across town from it?
If there is a separate class for the halfday kids, will that necessitate hiring another teacher, thereby negating some of the income from the fees?

CelticDragon wrote:

Definitely coming up with a questions list for the board.

Will there be a half day classroom at each school?
Will the half day kids be in with the full day kids and just miss whatever is planned for afternoon?
Will there be only one school with half day K?
If half day K is only in one school, will there be transport provided for those that live across town from it?
If there is a separate class for the halfday kids, will that necessitate hiring another teacher, thereby negating some of the income from the fees?

Good questions. Kaufman seems to be oblivious to the fact that he needs to make realistic cuts to the budget, not just symbolic cuts that are actually nothing more than moving costs around.

Another issue that I would bring up is how much it will cost in the future - first, second, third grades and beyond - to get the kids who attended half-day kindergarten caught up to the learning level of the kids who attended full-day kindergarten? Teachers have a tendency to hold up the advanced students in order to catch the rest up. This ararngement will only exasperate that.

One more question: Since kindergarten is optional, if they have to hire an additional teacher, will they be required to hire a certified teacher or will they give the half day kids to a para? I'm not so sure I'd trust them to not sneak that in.

I understand kindergarten goes beyond what it did in my day, but is it so advanced a para can't do it?

Wow - my computer died and I was offline lately. Thanks everyone for the good questions...I've actually been doing some asking and have some answers...

Will there be a half day classroom at each school?
NO. Kaufman thinks most every kid will go all day. So classes will stay the same, and some kids will just leave as others go to lunch, depending on if they paid or not.

Will the half day kids be in with the full day kids and just miss whatever is planned for afternoon?
YES. From what I heard, the teachers will have TWO sets of report cards and standards - one set of things for 1/2 day kids, and the other set for whole day kids.

Will there be only one school with half day K?
NO. The 1/2 kids will just leave at lunch, so parents can still pick their schools.

If half day K is only in one school, will there be transport provided for those that live across town from it?
N/A

If there is a separate class for the halfday kids, will that necessitate hiring another teacher, thereby negating some of the income from the fees?
N/A

Someone asked about a para teaching...umm, that's not legal in this state, I don't think.

I also heard that people on free lunch will not need to pay, and their kids will get to attend all day for free. But people on REDUCED lunch will be expected to pay the ENTIRE $500 - there is NO sliding scale.

I wonder what happens if they do this, but don't make the expected money from it.

Interesting that you have that information when even the Board of Education members don't.

nosy wrote:

Wow - my computer died and I was offline lately. Thanks everyone for the good questions...I've actually been doing some asking and have some answers...

Will there be a half day classroom at each school?
NO. Kaufman thinks most every kid will go all day. So classes will stay the same, and some kids will just leave as others go to lunch, depending on if they paid or not.

Will the half day kids be in with the full day kids and just miss whatever is planned for afternoon?
YES. From what I heard, the teachers will have TWO sets of report cards and standards - one set of things for 1/2 day kids, and the other set for whole day kids.

Will there be only one school with half day K?
NO. The 1/2 kids will just leave at lunch, so parents can still pick their schools.

If half day K is only in one school, will there be transport provided for those that live across town from it?
N/A

If there is a separate class for the halfday kids, will that necessitate hiring another teacher, thereby negating some of the income from the fees?
N/A

Someone asked about a para teaching...umm, that's not legal in this state, I don't think.

I also heard that people on free lunch will not need to pay, and their kids will get to attend all day for free. But people on REDUCED lunch will be expected to pay the ENTIRE $500 - there is NO sliding scale.

I wonder what happens if they do this, but don't make the expected money from it.

ok my question is......if the kids go half day and the need to ride a bus how much is the district really saving when having to run buses in the middle of the day?

Don't the buses run mid day already? So isn't it already in the budget?

Celtic, I didn't get that from the Board members...I heard that's what Kaufman has said.

nosy wrote:

Celtic, I didn't get that from the Board members...I heard that's what Kaufman has said.

Yeah.... but that's kind of the point. This "rumor" is running around town, while the BOE members, who are supposed to vote on it, don't have any idea what the answers to those questions are. I asked.

suzyr wrote:

Don't the buses run mid day already? So isn't it already in the budget?

The busses running at mid day would either be headstart or Special Education busses- different funding.

As a teacher, it seems unreasonable to have the 1/2 day kids in with the full day kids. More than likely the 1/2 day kids are going to miss music, pe, and art... which doesn't serve to better educate kids. What I'm saying is that the 1/2 day kids should have their own class(es) with modified schedules so that they get exposure to all the same things that the full day kids get. If these rumors are true, there are some serious kinks that are going to have to get worked out- and quickly!

Half day/ Full day options for kindergarten doesn't have to be the end of the world. When structured properly, I can see where it could work out quite well. But the level of each child's education needs to be fair. Beyond the initial issues that come into play I am surprised that they are waiting until the "last minute" to make this decision and then expecting parents to round 500 bucks out of thin air to start school. Could be difficult for lots of families. I guess I'm saying that it concerns me that this is being done so hastily.

I can think of better ways to trim the budget in a pinch than this. (I would think that you could start by trimming energy costs in the buildings for starters.) Keep in mind that the school budget situation doesn't look to be improving any time soon. That being said... I'm going to get up on my little soap box here-
If you are concerned about this- plan on going to that meeting. There needs to be as many parents as possible to show up for the board meeting prepared to ask questions that you have about this kindergarten issue. Even if not everyone gets to talk to the board directly, there is strength in numbers- and a room packed full of concerned parents will speak volumes to the board. Don't assume that they already know how you (parents) feel, or that someone else is going to speak up. They need to hear it from as many people as possible. I'm talking at the local (school board) level as well as the officials in Topeka. I'm saying that... everyone should contact your elected officials and encourage them to protect school funding. This issue reaches beyond August 2009. If the budget continues to get trimmed down, the districts are going to have less and less to work with so they will have to be creative to make things work. Ok- I'm off the soapbox now!
I've worked on this post for long enough- I know that some won't agree with me, but I hope I've provided at least some food for thought!

okay all you poor kids get the hell out! while we enhance the educaton of you all with money. If that was the case I would still be speaking Deutsch.

I guess it's yet another example of Kaufman thinking he makes the decisions.

Because I heard (and really, it's from someone connected to the schools) that Kaufman talks like this is already decided.

Who's Fred Kaufman?

Kaufman is the superindent of USD 489

suzyr wrote:

Don't the buses run mid day already? So isn't it already in the budget?

Buses run for Head Start already Im not sure what the deal with other buses running

CountryGirl wrote:

Kaufman is the superindent of USD 489

Is he doing a good job??

He says he is.

CelticDragon wrote:

Next School Board meeting is July 27th at 7 p.m., if anyone is interested.

Quote :

"We can talk about structuring our day so that (children) get the important basics, even if they're there for half a day," he said, giving one possibility.

"We're trying to make the fall with as little damage as possible."

Another money-saving idea to be looked at Monday is a 10-percent reduction in administrator and director salaries, proposed by school board member Greg Schwartz at the last meeting July 6.

According to district figures, that would open more than $150,000.

"I think it will have less of an impact than getting rid of kindergarten," Schwartz said at the time.

I think it would pay off if a group of you politely explained that administrators could probably absorb the 10% cut easier than a wise Latino mother trying to dig up $250 per semester on short notice.

That would be Latina. LOL.... A Latino mother might be frowned upon by others.

I didnt notice any mention about pay2play on their agenda. I wonder whats up with that?

suzyr wrote:

That would be Latina. LOL.... A Latino mother might be frowned upon by others.

A more inclusive, accepting society. That is what 0bama wants.

Well, I have a sick child today. Is anyone going to the meeting??

And I didnt realise it was on tv until the last 10 minutes so I missed what happened. Does anyone know?

luv2cook wrote:

And I didnt realise it was on tv until the last 10 minutes so I missed what happened. Does anyone know?

Wasn't on my TV.

They decided not to do the Kindergarten fee at this time. It was 3-3.

"no add'l kindergarten fee; increased workbook fee for all to $100; no pay cut for administrators"

Gee what a shocker no pay cut for the 4,000 assistant principals etc. Good deal the kindergarten thing didnt pass. Did they say anything about pay-2-play?

It was on Channel 13.

CountryGirl wrote:

"no add'l kindergarten fee;

So they can all go all day, right? This is good.

CountryGirl wrote:

increased workbook fee for all to $100;

For kindergarteners? How much was it before? This is bad.

CountryGirl wrote:

no pay cut for administrators"

This is bullshit.

the 100 is for everyone. It was 15 before, and they were going to raise it to 60, no matter what they did with kin. They just raised it more so everyone pays the same amount instead of one grade level paying so much. It's probably one of the fairest ways to do it.

Were there any cuts made is sports?

nitromaxx98 wrote:

Were there any cuts made is sports?

Of course not.The High School Football Coach even got his wife a job!!!!!

100 bucks a kid????AND school supplies????And to think the man or woman who buys toilet paper and groceries for the president probably makes 250K......this giving the education dept's the shaft is bullshit-cutting schools fundings so we can study how owls hump pisses me off

Wasn't there money in the stimulus plan to be given to states to help with education costs?

what ever happened to FREE SCHOOL????

jessks75 wrote:

what ever happened to FREE SCHOOL????

School was never free. Property taxes should be sufficient to cover the school budget. When those weren't enough, they told implemented the state lottery and told us that money from that would go for education. Since the administration can't control spending, now they're putting the screws to the families who have kids in school. Don't get me wrong. I agree with having fees for extra-curricular activities, including, but not limited to, sports. These activities are optional. That's why they're called extra-curricular. But the idea that the government compels parents to send their kids to school, then squeezes them for cash that would otherwise be going for food and housing for the families is criminal.

A woman I worked with in another life, grew up in California. She was surprised when she went to enroll her kids in school and she had to pay. Apparently, school is free in Cali. Maybe they should revisit that rule, if they haven't already.

suzyr wrote:

A woman I worked with in another life, grew up in California. She was surprised when she went to enroll her kids in school and she had to pay. Apparently, school is free in Cali. Maybe they should revisit that rule, if they haven't already.

Thats the problem with Kalifornia everything is free. the PRK is in such a whole with money they can't even pay attention